I apologize if this thread had already been made, I searched the forum for "salary cap threads" and none came up. I figured it would be ok if I
started a thread in the off-topic forum, but it not then the moderators can move/delete the thread at will. I figured a salary cap would spark some debate so I
wanted to know what the collective thoughts of the board are on the topic, especially that the board here is far more knowledgeable on the subject than your
average contingent of over zealous fans. I personally believe that there should be a salary cap in baseball due to the primary issue of fairness, but it would
have to be severely tweaked in order to work, specifically with a joint issuance of a price floor.
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Should there be a Salary Cap in Baseball?
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 calculatedreciprocity |
Should there be a Salary Cap in Baseball? |
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Rookie
Posts: 25 12/12/09 6:58 PM |
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ArodSucksAtLife |
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Veteran Member
Posts: 3821 12/12/09 11:56 PM Veteran Member |
No.
"A person can watch a hundreds of baseball games and unless they know what to look forward they won't be able to give a scouting report, which
is a lot different than following the ball or to know what the score is." - last seen 11/01/07
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SoxSail |
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Veteran Member
Posts: 428 12/13/09 7:30 PM |
What interests me more than a salary cap, is the salary floor that would go along with it. As Henry has stated, lots of shared revenues go to teams that pocket
them, rather than trying to put a better product on the field. Indeed, there is little incentive to win 70 games, rather than 65, since your fans will still
come at about the same rate. In fact, the way the draft is structured, there may actually be a disincentive. Rather than have a hard cap and a hard floor,
I'd rather continue with the luxury tax and revenue distribution model, but add a twist that values not just market size and revenue, but also wins into
the equation. Essentially, add to the marginal value of a win, not to the sport as a whole, rather than having thresholds where wins are significantly more or
less valuable. This system would encourage the development of players (which makes the game more fun to watch.)
By the way, if I'm the MLBPA, I'm doing anything in my power to make sure my aging members (veteran players) have ways of competing financially with equally talented younger players even though the latter also have upside, roster flexibility (options) and fixed prices. I'm thinking internally, the players should set up a veteran's fund which subsidizes the older player's salaries with skimming from the younger ones; hey, people voted for Social Security, right?
Last Edited By: SoxSail 12/13/09 7:37 PM.
Edited 1 time.
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calculatedreciprocity |
#3 | |||
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Rookie
Posts: 26 12/14/09 12:23 AM |
It's also interesting to note which teams the people who support/oppose a salary cap root for. For example, it seems that fans of big market teams would be
more likely to oppose a salary cap while fans of smaller market teams would be for it. It's also worth noting the effects of fan biases have on issues that
cross all fan boundaries.
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klostrophobic |
#4 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 3240 12/14/09 11:13 PM Veteran Member |
Yes.
Postponed: Wind
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Chach Collins |
#5 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 2447 12/15/09 1:14 AM |
No one ever voted for Social Security, it was set up in response to the Great Depression. There is a vast difference between ensuring that people don't
start to death and for someone who has made close to a million dollars, pre tax of course, over the course of a few years. Skimming sounds like a horrible
horrible idea. Careers are short in pro-sports and athletes lose enough money as it is to taxes and agent fees and the pension plan and what not. Taking more
money out of their pockets to subsidize another player's contract is morally and ethically wrong.
A salary cap is an equally horrible idea. The luxury tax system is the best system because it encourages teams to keep their spending withing reason but allows them the flexibility to spend their millions if they so choose. The system could use some tweaking but of the major sports league, it is the best system, both from a team and a player's standpoint. mahalo ~Chach~
Nesportsfan: I couldn't go to FaF for fear of getting killed by Chach.
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tdrowe |
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Posts: 1231 12/17/09 1:27 PM
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Wait, baseball has the best system from a team standpoint? Please.
NFL>NHL>NBA>MLB in that regard. The competitive balance in baseball sucks (IFA is imbalanced for the big markets, no cap is imbalanced for the big markets). |
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raftsox |
#7 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1490 12/17/09 4:33 PM |
tdrowe wrote:I'm sick of this belief. Prove that the IFA market is imbalanced. I personally love that the players get the money in baseball. Introducing a Salary Cap just means that the players get less and the owners get more. As far as I'm concerned, all a salary cap will do is result in your team getting to the cusp of a championship one year, only to have normal pay raises force you to make a trade of quality players because they no longer fit under the salary cap.
I am speechless. ...this site is not intended to be a place where you post every ridiculous and half-formed thought that comes into your head.
... You should post less. - AMarshal2
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tdrowe |
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Posts: 1233 12/18/09 1:04 AM
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The Patriots seem to be fine with these normal pay raises in the NFL...
The IFA market absolutely is imbalanced, teams with greater revenue streams are able to spend more. Even if you think this is not true, it's still imbalanced because the best teams get, at worst, an equal opportunity to sign a player as a poor team (standigs-wise). Yeah, screw a cap that will help stop alienating/pushing fans to other more competitive leagues. While we're at it, let's just determine draft order with a RNG. |
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raftsox |
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1491 12/18/09 12:47 PM |
tdrowe wrote:You can't compare the NFL to MLB because NFL contracts don't have to be guaranteed. Guaranteed contracts and a salary cap can cripple a franchise. If they're so happy with a salary cap why is the concensus that the new CBA won't include a salary cap? You haven't proven how the IFA market is imbalanced; you've stated why you think it is. Show me numbers that say the large market teams are the only ones signing these big name IFAs. Smart teams with good scouts sign the good players regardless of their financial clout. Strong development programs can turn an Ubaldo Jimenez into a front of the rotation starter. Even if you think this is not true, it's still imbalanced because the best teams get, at worst, an equal opportunity to sign a player as a poor team (standings-wise).So, how could the perennially poor Athletics find $6MM to sign Ynoa if they're competing against the Red Sox and Yankees? Aside from Chapman and maybe Iglesias (two completely different situations than traditional IFAs) there has historically not been an issue surrounding market differences and IFA acquisition. I get what you're trying to say: as a fan of the game you're frustrated that it seems like the small market teams are relegated to farm systems for the large market teams, and I agree with you to a point. But you're not going to convince me with those snide little comments. Come up with a reasonable argument to convince me that a salary cap is a good idea and I'll listen.
I am speechless. ...this site is not intended to be a place where you post every ridiculous and half-formed thought that comes into your head.
... You should post less. - AMarshal2
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tdrowe |
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Posts: 1236 12/18/09 11:50 PM
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IFA: Of course, Billy Beane preumably "gets" the idea of value with a constrained budget. You're right that I don't have the numbers to
compare teams properly, but you're just throwing out a random big-time signing. There are smaller signings that happen all the time, and the quantity of
top talent is heavily swayed in favor of the larger budget teams (and the teams that can afford higher scouting budgets).
Red Sox IFA since July 2007: Vinicio, Jose $1,950,000 Alcantara, Raul $500,000 Alcantara, Mario $350,000 Iglesias, Jose $6,000,000 Perez, Oscar $712,500 Ugas, Juan $300,000 Tazawa, Junichi $1,800,000 Almanzar, Michael $1,500,000 Espinoza, Rafael $250,000 Mendez, Roman $125,000 Garcia, Jose $260,000 Moanaroa, Boss $120,000 We're throwing around a lot of change on guys that have a super-low shot of ever reaching their potential. Small market teams simply can't afford to do that. At least most GMs are sensible enough to not waste their budgets on lottery tickets. As to your point about small-market teams being relegated to farm systems for large-market teams...I think it's pretty clear that capping FA spending (with a floor) would make smaller market teams take on more FA contracts than clinging to cost-controlled youngsters unlikely to make much of an impact on the team, while making large-market teams make more decisions of where to sacrifice production based on budgetary constraints. If I'm wrong, by all means do the legwork and show me the IFA imbalance is a mirage. I'm far too lazy to do such research atm. I personally would prefer some Dominican Minor League system without team affiliation, but connections with MLB, or some sort of Florida (GCL-lite) league with Dominican imports to put these guys on even footing as far as organization goes (and $-wise in the draft) as US high schoolers and collegians. Put them all in one draft that levels the scouting field.
Last Edited By: tdrowe 12/18/09 11:57 PM.
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raftsox |
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1492 12/19/09 9:58 PM |
Yes I am just throwing out a random big time IFA signing, the last handful of years the largest IFA signings are not made by large market teams. (As I said
before: I do not count Cuban defectors in this category because of their experience and age.) I tried to look up aggregate team IFAs from the last 5 years,
but we're blessed with all that Mike, et al. have accomplished because I just wasn't able to find them. I suspect Amfox1 has some sort of personal
data base and/or more knowledge of where to acquire the necessary info .
I am speechless. ...this site is not intended to be a place where you post every ridiculous and half-formed thought that comes into your head.
... You should post less. - AMarshal2
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