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CS% & Options at Catcher

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CS% & Options at Catcher

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Posts: 7021

10/12/09 10:12 AM

Mike Andrews
Editor-in-Chief
SoxProspects.com

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Of the 66 major league catchers that caught 30 or more games in 2009, George Kottaras, Victor Martinez, and Jason Varitek finished 61st, 63rd, and 64th in caught stealing percentage. It seems fairly set that Martinez is tabbed as the starting catcher in 2010, and Tek may be on his way out the door. One question for the off-season is whether the Sox will bring another catcher aboard (perhaps a defensive-minded catcher), or if they'll stick to their guns with George Kottaras. Here's a list of all MLB catchers with 30+ games, ranked by CS%. Free agents are in bold and free agents with options are in bold and italic.

PLAYER	TEAM	GP	GS	CSB	CS	CS%
Kenji Johjima	SEA	70	67	19	22	53.7%
Landon Powell	OAK	36	30	11	11	50.0%
David Ross	ATL	52	36	21	19	47.5%
Humberto Quintero	HOU	59	51	14	12	46.2%
Francisco Cervelli	NYY	40	25	13	10	43.5%
Ryan Hanigan	CIN	88	72	28	21	42.9%
Gerald Laird	DET	135	123	59	42	41.6%
Yadier Molina	STL	138	136	32	22	40.7%
Henry Blanco	SDG	60	58	27	18	40.0%
Koyie Hill	CHC	79	69	30	20	40.0%
Eli Whiteside	SFO	47	33	20	13	39.4%
Raul Chavez	TOR	51	44	29	18	38.3%
Taylor Teagarden	TEX	60	54	29	18	38.3%
Eliezer Alfonzo	SDG	30	28	15	9	37.5%
Ramon Castro	CHW/NYM	52	46	31	17	35.4%
*Ramon Hernandez*	CIN	55	53	33	18	35.3%
Ivan Rodriguez	TEX/HOU	115	108	41	22	34.9%
Brayan Pena	KAN	30	24	17	9	34.6%
Brian Schneider	NYM	57	52	19	10	34.5%
Rod Barajas	TOR	120	110	53	27	33.8%
Jason LaRue	STL	43	26	10	5	33.3%
Paul Bako	PHI	42	33	15	7	31.8%
Ryan Doumit	PIT	71	70	44	20	31.3%
Russell Martin	LAD	137	133	74	33	30.8%
Ronny Paulino	FLA	77	63	50	22	30.6%
Rob Johnson	SEA	80	75	41	18	30.5%
Brad Ausmus	LAD	30	27	14	6	30.0%
Omir Santos	NYM	91	74	35	15	30.0%
*Miguel Olivo*	KAN	103	97	56	22	28.2%
Jose Molina	NYY	49	42	23	9	28.1%
Geovany Soto	CHC	96	92	59	23	28.0%
Jason Jaramillo	PIT	62	58	36	14	28.0%
Jorge Posada	NYY	100	88	80	31	27.9%
Michel Hernandez	TAM	35	29	13	5	27.8%
Wil Nieves	WAS	71	65	34	13	27.7%
Carlos Ruiz	PHI	107	100	61	23	27.4%
Josh Bard	WAS	79	71	43	16	27.1%
Dioner Navarro	TAM	113	105	61	22	26.5%
Chris Iannetta	COL	89	87	50	18	26.5%
Joe Mauer	MIN	109	105	54	19	26.0%
Jeff Mathis	LAA	79	78	52	18	25.7%
Miguel Montero	ARI	111	101	67	23	25.6%
Robinzon Diaz	PIT	33	33	27	9	25.0%
Kurt Suzuki	OAK	135	132	81	27	25.0%
Matt Wieters	BAL	86	84	65	21	24.4%
Corky Miller	CHW/CIN	32	28	19	6	24.0%
Brian McCann	ATL	127	124	76	24	24.0%
Jarrod Saltalamacchia	TEX	83	82	61	19	23.8%
Chris Snyder	ARI	56	51	26	8	23.5%
Kelly Shoppach	CLE	81	74	49	15	23.4%
A.J. Pierzynski	CHW	131	124	99	30	23.3%
Bengie Molina	SFO	123	120	85	25	22.7%
Mike Napoli	LAA	96	84	74	21	22.1%
Mike Rivera	MIL	34	31	18	5	21.7%
Gregg Zaun	BAL/TAM	83	74	43	11	20.4%
John Baker	FLA	105	99	79	20	20.2%
Nick Hundley	SDG	74	71	56	14	20.0%
Jason Kendall	MIL	133	131	64	16	20.0%
Chris Coste	HOU/PHI	55	36	22	5	18.5%
John Buck	KAN	46	41	41	8	16.3%
George Kottaras	BOS	39	25	26	5	16.1%
Yorvit Torrealba	COL	64	61	49	8	14.0%
*Victor Martinez*	BOS/CLE	85	82	56	9	13.8%
Jason Varitek	BOS	108	106	108	16	12.9%
Mike Redmond	MIN	44	39	35	5	12.5%
Chad Moeller	BAL	30	28	25	2	7.4%

Last Edited By: soxprospects 10/12/09 12:10 PM. Edited 4 times.

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soxprospects

#1

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10/12/09 10:19 AM

Mike Andrews
Editor-in-Chief
SoxProspects.com

Just the potential free agents, with some additional stats:

PLAYER	TEAM	GP	GS	CSB	CS	CS%	E	FPCT	RF	ZR	PB	CERA	OPS
Henry Blanco	SDG	60	58	27	18	40.0%	0	1.000	8.36	3.053	2	4.76	0.703
Ramon Castro	CHW/NYM	52	46	31	17	35.4%	5	0.985	7.57	3.312	0	4.49	0.699
*Ramon Hernandez*	CIN	55	53	33	18	35.3%	1	0.997	7.56	3.355	0	4.45	0.699
Ivan Rodriguez	TEX/HOU	115	108	41	22	34.9%	7	0.992	7.84	3.200	7	4.59	0.663
Brian Schneider	NYM	57	52	19	10	34.5%	1	0.997	7.29	3.445	1	4.72	0.627
Rod Barajas	TOR	120	110	53	27	33.8%	8	0.991	7.95	3.181	6	4.28	0.661
Jason LaRue	STL	43	26	10	5	33.3%	1	0.995	6.63	3.856	1	4.54	0.615
Paul Bako	PHI	42	33	15	7	31.8%	5	0.981	7.91	3.149	6	3.94	0.644
Brad Ausmus	LAD	30	27	14	6	30.0%	0	1.000	7.87	3.257	2	3.68	0.712
*Miguel Olivo*	KAN	103	97	56	22	28.2%	8	0.990	8.14	3.105	10	4.52	0.781
Jose Molina	NYY	49	42	23	9	28.1%	1	0.997	9.77	2.655	3	3.35	0.560
Josh Bard	WAS	79	71	43	16	27.1%	5	0.988	6.05	4.168	3	4.98	0.655
Bengie Molina	SFO	123	120	85	25	22.7%	5	0.995	8.8	2.895	4	3.75	0.727
Gregg Zaun	BAL/TAM	83	74	43	11	20.4%	6	0.988	6.79	3.731	2	5.12	0.761
Jason Kendall	MIL	133	131	64	16	20.0%	8	0.992	7.3	3.475	4	4.98	0.636
Yorvit Torrealba	COL	64	61	49	8	14.0%	0	1.000	8.78	2.895	2	4.41	0.732
*Victor Martinez*	BOS/CLE	85	82	56	9	13.8%	4	0.992	6.84	3.709	4	5.64	0.861
Jason Varitek	BOS	108	106	108	16	12.9%	3	0.997	8.7	2.949	1	3.89	0.703
Mike Redmond	MIN	44	39	35	5	12.5%	0	1.000	6.42	3.949	2	5.38	0.588

Last Edited By: soxprospects 10/12/09 10:21 AM. Edited 1 time.

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terriblehondo

#2

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10/12/09 10:40 AM

I still think that a starting catcher that can throw is a priority. It is like watching a track meet when we play someone that is willing to run. Top base stealers are going to steal on anyone but anyone can steal on us. You have to be able to limit it a little bit. VMart can stay at first.

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buffs44444

#3

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10/12/09 10:42 AM

I guess the question is whether Victor's decline from two years of CS% over 30% to this year's 13.8% combined figure is an aberration or a trend. If it is a trend, does the FO pursue a long-term solution who can catch everyday? If it's an aberration, do they plan on Victor catching full-time in 2010?

Victor catching stats

My gut says they pursue a young, long-term solution at catcher who can be groomed this year in a platoon and eventually take over full-time in 2011 (when Victor and a soon-to-be-acquired 1B/DH will platoon at first, and Victor becoming a backup catcher).

While CS% isn't the only statistic that matters when evaluating a catcher, Varitek's decline almost ensures that he won't be the backup catcher in 2010. I can't see a light hitting catcher who can't control the running game being the primary backup, regardless of how comfortable members of the pitching staff feel when he catches them.

Tek stats

The uncertainty of the catching situation in general almost makes me wonder if the title of this thread should be "catching options" instead of the more specific "backup catching options".

Madness is like gravity....all you need is a little push.

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Boxer3610

#4

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10/12/09 10:48 AM

How about solving the problem within the organization and give Mark Wagner a shot?

"Easy there, Napoleon." - Mike Lowell on Dustin Pedroia

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ancientsoxfogey

#5

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10/12/09 11:18 AM

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Because of his offensive capabilities, it seems to me that VMart is a special case among catchers. You'd like to have him on the field offensively for 150+ games, but if he catches 120-130 games he almost needs complete offdays the rest of the time -- unless you consider DH'ing the equivalent of an offday, but the Sox already have plenty of DH candidates for 2010 (though not afterward). If the strategy is to play him at C and 1B, how many games can he really catch before you'd have to give him more total offdays than you want to take full advantage of his offense?

It may be that we need more of a co-catcher if VMart continues behind the plate and plays 1B, rather than the traditional backup catcher.

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Cem21

#6

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10/12/09 11:30 AM

Chris Mellen
Director of Scouting
SoxProspects.com

Boxer3610 wrote:
How about solving the problem within the organization and give Mark Wagner a shot?

I'd like to see Wagner get a shot to make the club as the backup as well. Assuming that the plan is for Martinez to catch 90-100 games next season while playing the balance of his starts over at 1B, that would leave 62-72 games for the backup next season. I'm not sure if they'd feel that Wagner is ready to step in for that chunk of games, but Wagner profiles as a better defensive catcher than Kottaras and is a notch or even notch and a half above Kottaras/Martinez in terms of getting his throws off. If they are going to go internal, in my opinion, Wagner is a much better option defensively for 70 games than Kottaras.

Martinez's release has looked poor in his time with the Sox. Most of his throws sail as he is rushing them or very long when he throws. Maybe that is something he can work through and correct to hover around average next season in terms of throwing runners out. Getting Martinez's bat for the full season, especially at Fenway where he should prosper with the Wall, I think you can live with him throwing around average or slightly below behind the plate with a stronger defensive backup for the balance of games.

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ORCoaster

#7

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10/12/09 11:41 AM

Our new pitching coach should be able to address this problem somewhat.

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soxprospects

#8

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10/12/09 11:58 AM

Mike Andrews
Editor-in-Chief
SoxProspects.com

Sox cumulative minor league CS% stats for Low-A and above:

	sb	cs	cs%
Carlos Maldonado	8	9	52.9%
Mark Wagner	39	34	46.6%
Will Vazquez	18	10	35.7%
Juan Apodaca	38	20	34.5%
John Otness	20	9	31.0%
Dusty Brown	59	26	30.6%
Tim Federowicz	92	40	30.3%
Ryan Lavarnway	91	35	27.8%
Michael Thomas	21	8	27.6%
Luis Exposito	91	32	26.0%
Ty Weeden	21	1	4.5%
Maykol Sanchez	8	0	0.0%

Special thanks to kjs4562.

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ancientsoxfogey

#9

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10/12/09 12:31 PM

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Maybe people would like to see Wagner get a crack at a catching spot on the roster in 2010, but I simply can't envision the Sox seeing it that way, at least for most of the season. Wagner gets high marks as a leader and a thrower, but lower marks for other nuances of the catching game (see his prospect summary), and we had a statement from the Sox not long ago how they pay a lot of attention to "catching nuances" as the prospects reach the high minors. That plus the fact that Wagner's progression through the minors has included a period of offensive adjustment at each level A+ and up. His latest adjustment period (hopefully) was his stint at AAA after his promotion this past season. Hopefully he'll follow history and show much better with the bat at Pawtucket in 2010. But I have to believe that the Sox are going to give him the opportunity to prove himself there before they move him to Boston.

I think a reasonably optimistic scenario for Wagner is that he gets a Sept. 2010 callup (assuming no serious injuries to the catchers on the big club next year), and the Sox really have to decide what his role will be starting in 2011. Or at best, if Wagner shows very well in AAA next year, a very late August callup so that the club might have the option of making him eligible for the postseason.

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Slumpbuster

#10

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10/12/09 12:53 PM

asf, I couldn't have said it better myself. Of course, my wordsmith days are behind me so the compliment is minimal.

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terriblehondo

#11

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10/12/09 1:03 PM

I added up the numbers and came up with 151 stolen bases and 30 caught stealing. That is not going to cut it. I think they need a catcher capable of catching at least 80 games. At this point in time I do not think Wagner can do it. If you go with VMart and watch his offense decline from catching everyday and if his throwing does not get better watch the same track meet that we had this year. My minimum requirements call a good game, block pitches, hit .240 and throw out 30% of base runners. Hopefully they can develop a shortstop and catcher in the very near future. While I would have made the trade at the time, Hanley sure did look good this year.

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GuapoGuapo

#12

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10/12/09 1:37 PM

Ramon Castro looks like a good option. Not too old, career OPS over .700. Kind of surprising he never wrangled a starting role. I guess being a fatty is part of it...

"I just really enjoy reading, man. It's totally a good way to stay centered." - Lars

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rangoon82

#13

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10/12/09 2:45 PM

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A good receiver with a gun is perfect. Give them the start when opposing speed is a factor. You can then play matchups w/ vmart behind the dish if you need more power less D.

I also wouldn't be opposed to revistiting a trade for a young guy to bring along. In 2009 Teagarden looked awful at the plate hitting .217 BA in just under 200 AB's, but he had a 18:29 CS:SB ratio for 38.3% CS. Seems like a good fit defensively and age-wise, plus his value prob. dropped b/c of his offense.

Last Edited By: rangoon82 10/12/09 2:51 PM. Edited 1 time.

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raftsox

#14

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Posts: 1359

10/12/09 4:32 PM

No to Teagarden.

He's played at his offensive level this past season.
Avg. OBP SLG BABIP
2008: .211 .319 .374 .277 (minor league stats)
2009: .217 .270 .374 .314

TT is quite simply very very overrated.

I am speechless. ...this site is not intended to be a place where you post every ridiculous and half-formed thought that comes into your head. ... You should post less. - AMarshal2

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Arthur Spooner

#15

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10/12/09 5:40 PM

Using these run values(5 per game), Sox catchers were around 11.6 runs below average this year at throwing out runners. Over a hole season, V-Mart's bat easily makes up for it, but adding a strong armed back up to come in late in games wouldn't be a bad idea.

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Atzar

#16

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Posts: 57

10/12/09 6:05 PM

Can somebody figure out how fast our pitchers are to the plate, relative to other teams? If you have one catcher who can't throw basestealers out, that's one thing, but the fact that all three of our catchers rank at the bottom of the league says that maybe this isn't entirely their fault.

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TWilliams4649

#17

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Posts: 123

10/12/09 6:17 PM

ORCoaster wrote:
Our new pitching coach should be able to address this problem somewhat.

Epstein said earlier today that he expects Farrell to be back in 2010. Farrell would rather be here than managing the Indians.

http://www.boston.com/spo...dsox/extras/extra_bases/

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jmei

#18

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10/12/09 6:57 PM

Forum Moderator

Keep in mind that it's not all about the catcher, but the pitchers too. I'd be interested in seeing a breakdown of CS% by pitcher. I know at least Penny was brutal about keeping guys honest, and that Buchholz's pickoff move was extremely raw as well.

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PrahaSMC

#19

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Posts: 747

10/12/09 7:09 PM

buffs44444 wrote:
I guess the question is whether Victor's decline from two years of CS% over 30% to this year's 13.8% combined figure is an aberration or a trend. If it is a trend, does the FO pursue a long-term solution who can catch everyday? If it's an aberration, do they plan on Victor catching full-time in 2010?

My gut says they pursue a young, long-term solution at catcher who can be groomed this year in a platoon and eventually take over full-time in 2011 (when Victor and a soon-to-be-acquired 1B/DH will platoon at first, and Victor becoming a backup catcher).

While CS% isn't the only statistic that matters when evaluating a catcher, Varitek's decline almost ensures that he won't be the backup catcher in 2010. I can't see a light hitting catcher who can't control the running game being the primary backup, regardless of how comfortable members of the pitching staff feel when he catches them.

The search for a "long-term" solution at catcher should begin and end with Victor Martinez, IMO.

Given the dropoff in salaries paid to non-elite talents last off-season and the continued decline in the economy, I think this off-season (with an unremarkable free agent class) could represent a bottoming out... especially in light of the fact the following winter's class of free agents could include Joe Mauer, Derek Jeter, Roy Halladay, Carl Crawford, and more. So, if there was ever a time to extend a player with a proven track-record of performance, it's now. If Martinez was amenable to a contract extension in the neighborhood of Posada's 4/52, I think the team should pounce.

When people talk of shoring up a position over the long-term, they naturally think of a young superstar. While Martinez doesn't meet that exact criteria, he's a damn good hitter (career OPS+ of 119), relatively young, and hasn't endured a particularly high number of innings behind the plate. Not to mention, who can the team acquire that is better? Planning for Joe Mauer, or the acquisition of a guy like Brian McCann, Yadier Molina, et al. is a pipe dream.

For people who question Victor Martinez's defense/game calling- I'm not buying it. CC Sabathia and Cliff Lee seemed to fair just fine throwing to him in their respective Cy Young seasons and the teams inability to throw out base stealers is as much a function of the pitchers as it is the catchers. If you want to help curtail the opponents' running game, acquire a defensive-minded back-up for off-days and to serve as a late-inning defensive replacement. Regardless, the solution is absolutely not to play Martinez at first base for 40-50 games a season, where you forfeit the value of having an .850 OPS behind the plate.

"This Kenny Mauer should go home to his wife... because nobody here loves him." - Tommy Heinsohn

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buffs44444

#20

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10/12/09 8:32 PM

I'm still waiting for the Rockies to give up on this guy.....or at least cash out while he has value.

Maybe Tracy is more comfortable with Torrealba next year to the point the Rockies trigger his option and deal Iannetta while grooming Rosario/McKenry. Iannetta is getting near his expensive years, so maybe.....

Madness is like gravity....all you need is a little push.

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