Sox Offseason (rumors) Thread in SoxProspects Discussion Forum

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Sox Offseason (rumors) Thread

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Boggs82		#141	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 96 11/16/11 6:15 PM	Deanskie wrote: Jon "The Mouth of Sauron" Heyman tweeted that the Yankees think the price for Edwin Jackson is too high. And since "E-Jax" is a Boras client, and is one of the maybe three or four pitchers on the free agent market that should be guaranteed a rotation spot, I'm guessing that's not just posturing; he's not going to be a bargain. Probably the thing I hate most about FA baseball. Because Edwin Jackson is like you said one of only a handful of good pitchers available. He will get a contract that does not correlate to his market value in terms of current pitchers signed to MLB deals. Then his contract will bump the market for mid-level pitchers next year. Does it not have to plateau some where?
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grandsalami		#142	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 63 11/16/11 6:26 PM	Red Sox keep tabs on free agent SS, starting at top with Jose Reyes Posted by Michael Silverman at 5:21 pm The Red Sox are keeping an eye on the free agent shortstop market, an interesting development considering that they have already exercised the $6 million 2012 option on shortstop Marco Scutaro and also have infielder Jed Lowrie in the fold. What it means is that the club has to be prepared to fill a shortstop need in case they deal away one of their shortstops — Lowrie, Scutaro or maybe even their shortstop of the future, Jose Iglesias. The Red Sox have checked in, according to a source, about the biggest free agent shortstop on the market, Jose Reyes, and although the club’s interest in Reyes would have to be classified as due diligence at this point, the fact that they bothered at all signals the club’s interest in keeping tabs on the best free agent player on the market who’s not a first baseman. Two other shortstops the club has called about are Cesar Izturis and Ronny Cedeno, each a classic great glove, weak offense type of shortstop. Asked about the club’s interest in shortstops, Red Sox general manager Ben Cherington said in an email that it is about “keeping options open so we can react to opportunities.” Lowrie, a switch-hitting shortstop just entering his prime but hounded by injuries the last couple of years, could be an intriguing part of any package the Red Sox could be considering in a trade. Dealing for a starting pitcher, perhaps from the A’s, Braves or Astros, is one route the club could take. Lowrie’s departure would create an opportunity for the Red Sox to fill the need for a dependable infield glove with someone like Izturis or Cedeno.
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grandsalami		#143	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 64 11/16/11 6:28 PM	DanBarbarisi Daniel Barbarisi Red Sox will have official meeting with CJ wilson's agent, Bob Garber, tonight at GM meetings.
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grkgodofwalks		#144	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 123 11/16/11 6:28 PM	grandsalami wrote: RT @SI_JonHeyman: Cj wilson seeks 6 years for close to $120M. Good luck with that. #dreaming BNightengale Bob Nightengale If Wakefield doesn't pitch next year w Red Sox it'd be a shame agent Meister says #mlb CJ Wilson is not worth even what Zito did when he walked into FA when he did. (Obviously Zito's contract is fraudulent, but as an example. Zito up to that point had established himself as a higher level starting pitcher.) That's a laugh. Wakefield can walk as far as I'm concerned.
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beasleyrockah		#145	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 276 11/16/11 6:44 PM	Yirmiyahu wrote: I think that, in the real world, "closer by committee" is doomed to fail. If a bullpen doesn't have any talent, they will perform terribly, the "closer by committee" philosophy will be blamed, and the team will acquire a closer. If the bullpen does have some talent, and starts the year with a "closer by committee" philosophy, the manager will inevitably start giving all of the save opportunities to the best reliever of the bunch. Knowing that we're not going to be hiring a manager who is a robot-sabremetrician, I kind of like the idea of signing a reasonably-priced, unspectacular guy to poach saves, while keeping Bard free to pitch the highest-leverage situations. This is my thinking as well. My only real focus would be to keep Bard in his current role, which is the high leverage relief ace role. My concern is that whoever they sign to be the closer will most likely be an inferior pitcher to Bard. If the manager is less creative, I fear early struggles of a Cordero/Nathan/Lidge would result in the "safe move" of Bard to the closer role. Since popular belief around baseball is the closer has the most important role, giving an inferior pitcher the closer spot without competition will upset Bard as it will cost him significant money (saves pay in arb). If Bard is the defined 8th inning guy, and whatever non elite closer they bring in is the automatic 9th inning guy, you can't really play the leverage game with Bard. The strategy and roles obviously depend a lot on who the Red Sox actually bring in. If it's a Lidge or Cordero, Bard should get 10-15 9th inning save appearances over the course of the season. I'd rather not blindly give Bard every 8th inning and give a Lidge/Cordero every 9th inning just because they feel more comfortable. I think the closer by committee route is risky and respect the comfort level of "knowing your role", but I have no doubts that it could work with the right pieces. For example, I think Kimbrel and Venters could switch off between the 8th and 9th based on matchups without falling apart with self doubt over an identity crisis. There is a happy medium between giving one guy every save opportunity and keeping an open mind due to the situation and matchups.
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beasleyrockah		#146	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 277 11/16/11 6:50 PM	http://news.bostonherald....rvc=home&position=recent “He loves being a Red Sox, but he loves being a baseball player,” Meister said. “And if, for some reason they don’t think he can play, well, then he’s going to win 15 games somewhere else and show them that, once again, they’ve underestimated him. But he loves Boston. Whether it’s the Wakefield charity or the Jimmy Fund, this is his community and he feels like he can help this club. He feels like he has unfinished business. He wants to win. He wants to put another ring on his finger. He wants a parade. He’s from Boston now, right?” Is this real life?
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FenwayTheHardWay		#147	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 3265 11/16/11 7:04 PM Veteran Member	beasleyrockah wrote: http://news.bostonherald....rvc=home&position=recent “He loves being a Red Sox, but he loves being a baseball player,” Meister said. “And if, for some reason they don’t think he can play, well, then he’s going to win 15 games somewhere else and show them that, once again, they’ve underestimated him. But he loves Boston. Whether it’s the Wakefield charity or the Jimmy Fund, this is his community and he feels like he can help this club. He feels like he has unfinished business. He wants to win. He wants to put another ring on his finger. He wants a parade. He’s from Boston now, right?” Is this real life? I don't know if the indy ball season is long enough for him to get 15 wins. "thats 4 dingers tonite for #rays off wakefield, who looks his age, only older" - Jon Heyman
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Deanskie		#148	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 102 11/16/11 7:09 PM	beasleyrockah wrote: http://news.bostonherald....rvc=home&position=recent “He loves being a Red Sox, but he loves being a baseball player,” Meister said. “And if, for some reason they don’t think he can play, well, then he’s going to win 15 games somewhere else and show them that, once again, they’ve underestimated him. But he loves Boston. Whether it’s the Wakefield charity or the Jimmy Fund, this is his community and he feels like he can help this club. He feels like he has unfinished business. He wants to win. He wants to put another ring on his finger. He wants a parade. He’s from Boston now, right?” Is this real life? This is good news right? It means the Red Sox haven't really bothered to be in touch with Wakefield's agent. Wish he could manage to go out with some dignity though. Screw the troops. Or at the very least, buy them a drink.
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qutennis5		#149	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 499 11/16/11 8:26 PM	Wakefield is just a d-bag and wish him gone for good. First with his "the fans deserve to see me get the most wins for a Sox player" and now this from his agent. A-hole.
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MLBDreams		#150	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 675 11/16/11 8:45 PM	beasleyrockah wrote: http://news.bostonherald....rvc=home&position=recent “He loves being a Red Sox, but he loves being a baseball player,” Meister said. “And if, for some reason they don’t think he can play, well, then he’s going to win 15 games somewhere else and show them that, once again, they’ve underestimated him. But he loves Boston. Whether it’s the Wakefield charity or the Jimmy Fund, this is his community and he feels like he can help this club. He feels like he has unfinished business. He wants to win. He wants to put another ring on his finger. He wants a parade. He’s from Boston now, right?” Is this real life? I don't think he's going to win 15 games in 2012 season for the Red Sox. He got only 7 win out of 23 starts included brutal 8 attempts of winning 200 MLB games. I'm no longer enjoy by watching him give up more runs, give up bombs, catcher getting passed balls, throw some wild pitches, gave up walks and easy stolen bases for opponents. Just go away from us & sign with NL team for minimum salary. We're all want to keep you around for Jimmy Fund & charities but not on RS team anymore.
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MLBDreams		#151	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 676 11/16/11 9:29 PM	beasleyrockah wrote: This is my thinking as well. My only real focus would be to keep Bard in his current role, which is the high leverage relief ace role. My concern is that whoever they sign to be the closer will most likely be an inferior pitcher to Bard. If the manager is less creative, I fear early struggles of a Cordero/Nathan/Lidge would result in the "safe move" of Bard to the closer role. Since popular belief around baseball is the closer has the most important role, giving an inferior pitcher the closer spot without competition will upset Bard as it will cost him significant money (saves pay in arb). If Bard is the defined 8th inning guy, and whatever non elite closer they bring in is the automatic 9th inning guy, you can't really play the leverage game with Bard. The strategy and roles obviously depend a lot on who the Red Sox actually bring in. If it's a Lidge or Cordero, Bard should get 10-15 9th inning save appearances over the course of the season. I'd rather not blindly give Bard every 8th inning and give a Lidge/Cordero every 9th inning just because they feel more comfortable. How he's going to be successful as closer when Dan didn't perform well as set up man? He's 2-9 as record with 5 blown saves and 3.33 ERA. Dan's Sept collapses were evidence like control problems from his awful 2007 MiLB season. Do you want give him the job by knowing he would blew it & lose the game? He don't have mental toughness that Jon Papbelbon & Marino Riveria usually have. His ERA from MLB seasons were up & down & up. Before Sept collapse, I don't mind him as future closer in case Jon leaves the team but now, I don't. We don't know who our next RS pitcher coach is. It's important not to carry over his awful Sept into 2012 season as the new pitcher coach will fix his mechanics. We'll see what happens once Ben makes his decision.
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JimRiceRocks		#152	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 1905 11/16/11 9:59 PM Veteran Member	qutennis5 wrote: Wakefield is just a d-bag and wish him gone for good. First with his "the fans deserve to see me get the most wins for a Sox player" and now this from his agent. A-hole. He has been a very popular player among the general fan base. This was a silly comment. What is agent said was what? He'd like to be a Red Sox, if not he'll win 14 games somewhere else. So he has confidence in the guy. You expected him to say he'll g somewhere else and go 4-9 with a 5.35 ERA? His agent went on to say he takes what the Sox tell him at face value, they've always been honest with him. So what the hell? Has Wake lingered beyond his welcome? For many yes - and I'd agree, time to move on. You may think he sucks and hate watching him pitch and want him gone form the Sox. But he's one of top Sox as far as giving back to the community and has given his heart and soul to Sox organization for a very long time. Calling the guy a D-Bag and A-Hole shows no class. You're a disgrace! "You can never have too much bitching" - left coast bosox fan "No wonder a lot of opponent's announcers have bullpenis envy - left coast bosox fan
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Sibby Sisti		#153	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 625 11/16/11 10:36 PM	I'm sure BC won't opt for the closer-by-committee scenario. I do believe his closer will be announced at the close of Spring Training. Ben will most likely bring in a former closer such as Nathan or Broxton to compete with Bard and, possibly, Jenks for the 9th inning role. I hope he doesn't sign Madsen and lose a ist round pick after just acquiring one, albeit #31, for Papelbon.
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BNich0622		#154	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 250 11/16/11 11:47 PM	Sibby Sisti wrote: I'm sure BC won't opt for the closer-by-committee scenario. I do believe his closer will be announced at the close of Spring Training. Ben will most likely bring in a former closer such as Nathan or Broxton to compete with Bard and, possibly, Jenks for the 9th inning role. I hope he doesn't sign Madsen and lose a ist round pick after just acquiring one, albeit #31, for Papelbon. What I meant by my "closer by committee" comments is exactly what you mentioned. They will bring guys in with closing experience and let them including Bard duke it out in spring training. I don't expect them to make a move and anoint someone closer duties at this point in the off season. I do think they will bring in arms like every off season, just hopefully some guys with good track records as closers and they will go with the best option out of camp.
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pedroiayouk1520		#155	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 150 11/17/11 12:13 AM	MLBDreams wrote: beasleyrockah wrote: This is my thinking as well. My only real focus would be to keep Bard in his current role, which is the high leverage relief ace role. My concern is that whoever they sign to be the closer will most likely be an inferior pitcher to Bard. If the manager is less creative, I fear early struggles of a Cordero/Nathan/Lidge would result in the "safe move" of Bard to the closer role. Since popular belief around baseball is the closer has the most important role, giving an inferior pitcher the closer spot without competition will upset Bard as it will cost him significant money (saves pay in arb). If Bard is the defined 8th inning guy, and whatever non elite closer they bring in is the automatic 9th inning guy, you can't really play the leverage game with Bard. The strategy and roles obviously depend a lot on who the Red Sox actually bring in. If it's a Lidge or Cordero, Bard should get 10-15 9th inning save appearances over the course of the season. I'd rather not blindly give Bard every 8th inning and give a Lidge/Cordero every 9th inning just because they feel more comfortable. How he's going to be successful as closer when Dan didn't perform well as set up man? He's 2-9 as record with 5 blown saves and 3.33 ERA. Dan's Sept collapses were evidence like control problems from his awful 2007 MiLB season. Do you want give him the job by knowing he would blew it & lose the game? He don't have mental toughness that Jon Papbelbon & Marino Riveria usually have. His ERA from MLB seasons were up & down & up. Before Sept collapse, I don't mind him as future closer in case Jon leaves the team but now, I don't. We don't know who our next RS pitcher coach is. It's important not to carry over his awful Sept into 2012 season as the new pitcher coach will fix his mechanics. We'll see what happens once Ben makes his decision. Daniel Bard is a great relief pitcher despite the 9 losses. He had so many losses last year because he was put into tight situations in almost every appearance. Despite the losses and blown saves, he was still successful at holding the lead 81% of the time last year. I would assume that his awful September was just because he ran out of gas and lost his mechanics. If anything, being a closer would probably be an easier role for Bard because he would only be responsible for pitching 1 inning compared to coming in with the bases loaded and no outs in the 8th inning against the opposing clean-up hitter.
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pedroiayouk1520		#156	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 151 11/17/11 12:22 AM	BNich0622 wrote: Sibby Sisti wrote: I'm sure BC won't opt for the closer-by-committee scenario. I do believe his closer will be announced at the close of Spring Training. Ben will most likely bring in a former closer such as Nathan or Broxton to compete with Bard and, possibly, Jenks for the 9th inning role. I hope he doesn't sign Madsen and lose a ist round pick after just acquiring one, albeit #31, for Papelbon. What I meant by my "closer by committee" comments is exactly what you mentioned. They will bring guys in with closing experience and let them including Bard duke it out in spring training. I don't expect them to make a move and anoint someone closer duties at this point in the off season. I do think they will bring in arms like every off season, just hopefully some guys with good track records as closers and they will go with the best option out of camp. I don't think there's any way that Cherington is gonna let the guys "duke it out" for the closer role in spring training. This decision will have to be made before Sping Training. In order for a bullpen to be successful, guys have to know their roles and be comfortable with their roles. You can't just sign a guy and say "you might be the closer, or maybe not." Also, a successful bullpen needs 3 solid arms for the 7th - 9th inning (aka Aceves/Bard/Pap). The order of those 3 innings doesn't necessary have to be directly related to how well the guy pitches in spring training. I really wanted the Sox to keep Pap, but he was clearly too expensive and no reliever should get 4 years. I would be okay with Madson if the Sox can get him at 3/24M because he pretty much has no red flags, unlike every other top reliever on the market. He is also young and unlikely to decline soon. He also has big market and playoff experience and would finalize the bullpen if signed. Getting a guy like Madson would also leave the Sox with the option to move Aceves into the #5 spot in the rotation and move him back to the pen in September for the stretch run/playoffs. Anyone who thinks moving Bard and Aceves to the rotation is crazy because there is no way that either of those guys come close to 200 IP. I'd only put Aceves in the #5 spot if the Sox trade or sign for a real solid #4 guy.
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Average Fan		#157	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 553 11/17/11 9:39 AM Veteran Member	Deanskie wrote: Wish he could manage to go out with some dignity though. Exactly. Love Wake but it's time for him to hang up the jersey. It's so sad to see him trying to hang on like a punch drunk fighter.
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Mhueg		#158	[url]	[-]
Posts: 831 11/17/11 11:11 AM Matt Huegel Senior Editor SoxProspects.com	pedroiayouk1520 wrote: I don't think there's any way that Cherington is gonna let the guys "duke it out" for the closer role in spring training. This decision will have to be made before Sping Training. In order for a bullpen to be successful, guys have to know their roles and be comfortable with their roles. You can't just sign a guy and say "you might be the closer, or maybe not." Also, a successful bullpen needs 3 solid arms for the 7th - 9th inning (aka Aceves/Bard/Pap). The order of those 3 innings doesn't necessary have to be directly related to how well the guy pitches in spring training. Cherington said specifically that he was open to not having a set closer going into spring training, but that he would want one in place by Opening Day. If you brought in someone like Joe Nathan, for instance, you could see how he looked during the spring and then if he looked like he was close to his pre-TJ self decide to put him back in that role. Or just let Bard prove that it should be his role. I see no problem with a little position battle in the spring.
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adiospaydro2005		#159	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 2361 11/17/11 12:29 PM Veteran Member	The Red Sox offseason from hell is even worse than any of us could imagine... AdamRubinESPN Adam Rubin RT @MaureenaMullen: According to a source, #RedSox could be interested in adding Omar Minaya to baseball ops staff. Poorest spending of $3 million that I have ever seen.-fcastig 0220
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Steve Dillard		#160	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 1649 11/17/11 12:55 PM	Omar has good Latin connections. Combined with Alex Speirs' tweet about Craig Shipley leaving, that makes sense that Omar will be in charge of the Latin market. I'm fine with that.
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