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Red Sox Reach Tentative Agreement with Mike Cameron

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Yirmiyahu

#41

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Posts: 742

12/14/09 10:07 PM

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basestealer21 wrote:
$7.75 million a year sounds pretty reasonable...

Agreed. Sorry for the confusion. I meant, I expected a 1-year deal for $7-$8.

ADD: Probably makes no difference at all, but still hoping the 2nd year is some kind of option.

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BoSox81

#42

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12/14/09 10:14 PM

Wouldn't this deal also make the Mets the frontrunners for Holliday?

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templeUsox

#43

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12/14/09 10:15 PM

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The Mets are very high on Jason Bay.

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Union4Sox

#44

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12/14/09 10:17 PM

The move makes sense.

I was never for re-signing Bay. I thought the resources could be allocated to much better players (see: Lackey).

That being said, the lack of a pure power bat in the lineup is going to be very noticeable if a significant offensive acquisition is not made....

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FenwayTheHardWay

#45

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12/14/09 10:18 PM

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templeUsox wrote:
The Mets are very high on Jason Bay.

Man... I suppose the Mets could be stupider, but it'd be hard.

"Jonathan Papelbon, not wasting any time, going to his bread and butter there, and that's the cheese."- Buck Martinez

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basestealer21

#46

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12/14/09 10:21 PM

Yirmiyahu wrote:

basestealer21 wrote:
$7.75 million a year sounds pretty reasonable...
Agreed. Sorry for the confusion. I meant, I expected a 1-year deal for $7-$8.

ADD: Probably makes no difference at all, but still hoping the 2nd year is some kind of option.

Fair and I agree for hoping there's an option. The only reason I like the second year is as a backup who can field every position and still run a bit. Maybe we land a bigger bat in next years free agency while Reddick or Kalish gets groomed to be our 3 position backup.

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flap1919

#47

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12/14/09 10:23 PM

Obviously 1 year deal would be preferable, but Cameron could be seen as a bridge to the Kalish/Lin/Reddick types in the system, hoping Hermida can turn into a legit LF option and 2 of those guys can step in when Drew and Cameron move on.

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gregblossersbelly

#48

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12/14/09 10:32 PM

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FenwayTheHardWay wrote:

templeUsox wrote:
The Mets are very high on Jason Bay.

Man... I suppose the Mets could be stupider, but it'd be hard.

Jason Bay will .257 14 hr and 71 rbi's next year in that stadium. He'll be a liability in LF. And, will be getting booed unmercifully as the Mets stumble to a 4th place finish.

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klostrophobic

#49

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12/14/09 10:36 PM

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Whoa, sweet. For some reason I thought Cameron had signed somewhere else already. Best signing of the off-season. So many ways the OF could be aligned. I wonder if Drew could be moved to LF; it would probably keep him fresher and would allow Ellsbury and Cameron to cover the largest parts of the OF.

Postponed: Wind

Last Edited By: klostrophobic 12/14/09 10:40 PM. Edited 1 time.

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AMarshal2

#50

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12/14/09 10:39 PM

klostrophobic wrote:
Whoa, sweet. For some reason I thought Cameron had signed somewhere else already. Best signing of the off-season. So many ways the OF could be aligned. I wonder if Drew could be moved to LF; it would probably keep him fresher and would allow Ellsbury and Cameron to cover the largest parts of the OF.

I'm embarrassed I hadn't thought of this. How's Cameron's arm? I might like this idea...

aminahyaquin: Alou is a 37 year old 7 time MVP with a .347 lifetime batting average and a world of hustle. he can golden glove field in his sleep.
tGG: Alou is actually 42, has never won an MVP, has a .303 lifetime batting average, and is mediocre at best in the field.
joshv02: But, other than that, you're wrong.

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jspearlj1

#51

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12/14/09 10:58 PM

Cameron's got the arm even for Fenway's RF and he has some experience there playing alongside Beltran in NY. However, it just seems like a waste of Drew and him (Drew has only 182 innings of experience in LF and Cameron has only marginal experience in RF). His UZR in RF was nothing special in a small sample 1.9 (800 innings) so i don't really see the benefit there.

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raftsox

#52

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12/14/09 11:01 PM

AMarshal2 wrote:

klostrophobic wrote:
Whoa, sweet. For some reason I thought Cameron had signed somewhere else already. Best signing of the off-season. So many ways the OF could be aligned. I wonder if Drew could be moved to LF; it would probably keep him fresher and would allow Ellsbury and Cameron to cover the largest parts of the OF.
I'm embarrassed I hadn't thought of this. How's Cameron's arm? I might like this idea...

4 runs below average according to fangraphs. Can't say as I really believe it though; arm strength is too dependent on the batting situation for my taste.

I am speechless. ...this site is not intended to be a place where you post every ridiculous and half-formed thought that comes into your head. ... You should post less. - AMarshal2

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OCD SS

#53

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12/14/09 11:20 PM

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There was a pretty good article on Fangraphs at the beginning of the offseason trumpeting Mike Cameron as a logical alternative to Bay. It looks very prescient now...

I'm a little concerned as if the Sox are keeping Jacoby I would like to see him continue to develop as a CFer (for the reasons Temple already brought up). I expect he'll get some play there when Cameron has a day off, but overall I'm not as interested in him as Carl Crawford V2.0 (of course OTOH I never expected the Sox to keep him around past his arb years).

At the end of the day though, this makes the Sox a tough defensive team, and I don't think they can sign Cameron to play anything but CF (the tension between him and Beltran was palpable). I'd like to see a major move at 1B, and now the roster is flexible enough to support it.

Edit: although now that I've scanned more articles, it appears that Cameron may have agreed to play LF. That works pretty well for me.

"I'd like to f*ck Sandra Bullock" - Pedro, explaining his secret ambition to Sports Illustrated for Kids.

Last Edited By: OCD SS 12/14/09 11:26 PM. Edited 1 time.

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back2basix3593

#54

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12/14/09 11:28 PM

he has logged significantly more playing time in right field han left field

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Yirmiyahu

#55

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12/14/09 11:35 PM

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jspearlj1 wrote:
Cameron's got the arm even for Fenway's RF and he has some experience there playing alongside Beltran in NY. However, it just seems like a waste of Drew and him (Drew has only 182 innings of experience in LF and Cameron has only marginal experience in RF). His UZR in RF was nothing special in a small sample 1.9 (800 innings) so i don't really see the benefit there.

Just throwing this out there. Maybe it gives a little bit of idea of each outfielder's relative strengths. Here's each player's career [actually, post-2002, because that's what's available on fangraphs] outfield numbers:

	Inn	Arm	RngR	ErrR	UZR	UZR/150
Hermida	3850.7	-6.5	-15.3	-4.9	-26.7	-8.90
Drew	7583.7	-13.2	46.0	3.0	35.8	6.60
Cameron	9355.7	-11.8	53.1	-1.4	39.9	5.40
Ellsbury	2733.7	-7.4	3.3	2.2	-2.0	-1.20

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flap1919

#56

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Posts: 3087

12/14/09 11:45 PM

Cameron can be the starting LF and the backup CF/RF. Hermida really shouldn't play anywhere but LF with those other 3 guys in the mix. As big of a deleted as Drew is he's been a very solid RF in his time with the Sox. I love Jacoby going back on the ball in CF, and I don't think Cameron is a waste in Fenway, he can play closer to CF and Ellsbury can play closer to RF so less flyballs should hit the ground. As I mentioned before, there are also 81 games during the year not played at Fenway. Plus he's going to hit 7th (if Kotchman is at 1B, or 8th if the bring in a bigger bat at 1B/3B).

edit: easy on the potentially offensive language.

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DCRi

#57

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12/14/09 11:47 PM

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I am not excited by this deal. Cameron is 37 and is not the player he once was. He still is a fairly good defender, but he is in decline. He makes a lot of outs at the plate. His OBP is not that great. I would like him a lot as a 4h OF, but not as a regular. He will improve the defense significantly if playing LF, but he will not have the bat that is needed there.

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IBSmith85

#58

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Posts: 94

12/14/09 11:51 PM

Yirmiyahu wrote:

jspearlj1 wrote:
Cameron's got the arm even for Fenway's RF and he has some experience there playing alongside Beltran in NY. However, it just seems like a waste of Drew and him (Drew has only 182 innings of experience in LF and Cameron has only marginal experience in RF). His UZR in RF was nothing special in a small sample 1.9 (800 innings) so i don't really see the benefit there.

Just throwing this out there. Maybe it gives a little bit of idea of each outfielder's relative strengths. Here's each player's career [actually, post-2002, because that's what's available on fangraphs] outfield numbers:

Inn Arm RngR ErrR UZR UZR/150

Hermida 3850.7 -6.5 -15.3 -4.9 -26.7 -8.90

Drew 7583.7 -13.2 46.0 3.0 35.8 6.60

Cameron 9355.7 -11.8 53.1 -1.4 39.9 5.40

Ellsbury 2733.7 -7.4 3.3 2.2 -2.0 -1.20

Can someone explain "Arm" and how the score works, cause it looks like the graph says Ellsbury has a better/more accurate arm than Drew and Cameron, that cant be the case right?

"I will repeat as Rookie of the Year" - Dustin Pedroia

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Nexus

#59

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Posts: 389

12/14/09 11:52 PM

Cameron's spent the bulk of his career playing at Safeco, Shea, Petco, and Miller... none are particularly friendly to RH hitters. After checking out his hit charts, he could be the 30+ HR bat Papi was asking for.

It should also be noted, with the exception of '09 (23rd), Cameron has been in the top 15 for pitches per PA in his respective league every year since becoming a full-time player in '99.

EDIT: Response to DCRs post.

Last Edited By: Nexus 12/15/09 12:02 AM. Edited 2 times.

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ScottLevison

#60

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12/14/09 11:55 PM

Adios, Mr. Bay. Don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya...

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Red Sox Reach Tentative Agreement with Mike Cameron