Toronto Blue Jays sign Alex Gonzalez

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jsinger121		#21	[url]	[-]
Posts: 15569 11/26/09 9:14 PM Jonathan Affiliate Correspondent SoxProspects.com	mredsox89 wrote: Arquimedez Bozo wrote: mredsox89 wrote: Definitely a mistake on the Sox's part to not pick up his $6M option. But one has to believe they have had another plan ready to set in motion. How do you figure? He got less than half of that. On no planet is Alex Gonzalez worth $6M, and apparently even he knows that. If you want to say it was a mistake not to just commit $3M to him now, then fine, we can agree to disagree there, but come on. Well I guess that is what I was getting at. I just read that the sox wouldn't even give $3 million. I base that it was a mistake because it will cost more for the alternative, and if it doesn't, it will be a step back. A $3M difference wouldn't be something that kept the sox from making a bigger move. And now they are probably going to have to spend at least $10M. I doubt they will spend 10 Million. They may not even look at 2010 as a season where they go for a championship. They make look to take a step back which to me will be fine since there is nothing on the free agent market I'd give up draft picks for. Twitter: @Jonathan_Singer/@Soxprospects
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mredsox89		#22	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 860 11/26/09 9:25 PM	jsinger121 wrote: mredsox89 wrote: Arquimedez Bozo wrote: mredsox89 wrote: Definitely a mistake on the Sox's part to not pick up his $6M option. But one has to believe they have had another plan ready to set in motion. How do you figure? He got less than half of that. On no planet is Alex Gonzalez worth $6M, and apparently even he knows that. If you want to say it was a mistake not to just commit $3M to him now, then fine, we can agree to disagree there, but come on. Well I guess that is what I was getting at. I just read that the sox wouldn't even give $3 million. I base that it was a mistake because it will cost more for the alternative, and if it doesn't, it will be a step back. A $3M difference wouldn't be something that kept the sox from making a bigger move. And now they are probably going to have to spend at least $10M. I doubt they will spend 10 Million. They may not even look at 2010 as a season where they go for a championship. They make look to take a step back which to me will be fine since there is nothing on the free agent market I'd give up draft picks for. Ok, well if they are not looking at 2010 for a championship then obviously its all a great move since they are saving money. I just don't see this team not aiming for a title every season
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jsinger121		#23	[url]	[-]
Posts: 15571 11/26/09 9:33 PM Jonathan Affiliate Correspondent SoxProspects.com	When Theo took over he said the goal was to make the playoffs 8 out of every 10 years and see what happens in the playoffs. Well so far he has made it 6 out of the 7 years. If this is the year they take a step back and then make the playoffs the next two to three years then he is making good on his promise. There is no reason to waste big money on a guy like Marco Scutaro who had a career year last year and even in a career year he didn't break an .800 OPS. I thought the big loss was when they couldn't land JJ Hardy who I would have loved playing shortstop because at least he has some upside with his age. Scutaro has zero upside at his age and is very likely to regress while being vastly overpaid. Twitter: @Jonathan_Singer/@Soxprospects
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jdb		#24	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 291 11/26/09 9:35 PM	I wonder who these teams are that cant wait to give up their first round pick and a 3 year deal for a 34 year old SS coming off a career year. Sure he is solid and I would be fine if it were just money on a two year deal but 3 and a pick? No thanks. Tito said a few weeks ago that its hard to have a regular with a .310 OBP so I think a guy like Adam Everett would be out. Im not sure how we upgrade it but we need someone in case Lowrie cant handle it. Could a guy like Izturis be available in LA. I would almost take a contract like Milton Bradley if it ment Theriot coming here. Last Edited By: jdb 11/26/09 9:41 PM. Edited 1 time.
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FenwayTheHardWay		#25	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 1661 11/26/09 9:38 PM Veteran Member	Yeah, we're totally not going to compete for a championship in '10 because we lost out on a 1.5 win player in November. That makes sense. Seriously, Alex Gonzalez is not very good. Go get Adam Everett, there's not a dime's worth of difference between the two. Bedwetters. "Jonathan Papelbon, not wasting any time, going to his bread and butter there, and that's the cheese."- Buck Martinez
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adiospaydro2005		#26	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 1540 11/26/09 9:46 PM Veteran Member	FenwayTheHardWay wrote: adiospaydro2005 wrote: No one is going to win a world championship with Punto as their starting shortstop. Dude, Nick Punto is a better player than Gonzalez. Punto: 18.1 UZR/150 in 1775.0 career innings at shortstop, .322 career OBP. Alex Gonzalez: 6.9 UZR/150 in 10320.0 career innings at SS, .294 career OBP Punto can also pick it at second or third, and would make a nifty utility infielder if Lowrie ends up healthy and productive. My point isn't that Punto is some kind of great player, my point is that replacing Gonzalez is not a big deal. Any glove will do. It isn't about Punto or Gonzalez as I don't think either of them are legitimate starting shortstops on teams aspiring to win the World Series. The Red Sox obviously decided to move a different direction at shortstop when they told Gonzalez they would get back to him if they couldn't get someone better in the 2009 winter meetings. The Twins obviously thought they needed to get a better shortstop when they acquired Cabrera during the 2009 season and they went out to acquire Hardy this offseason. Here's a great quote from Fangraphs about Punto which I think describes him accurately... Nick Punto may be heralded as one of those rare players who, despite having little tangible hitting talent, does those little things so well that he can bring a team to the top. Don't believe it - it's not true. Look at Punto for what he really is - a tremendous defender who managed to put together a couple of seasons with a solid BABIP. He's a great bench player who can adequately fill in at any non-1B infield position, but any team that starts him wont' be a perennial playoff contender. That is, unless that team's catcher is Joe Mauer. http://www.fangraphs.com/...to-and-the-little-things Poorest spending of $3 million that I have ever seen.-fcastig 0220
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buffs44444		#27	[url]	[-]
Moderator Veteran Member Posts: 1397 11/26/09 9:47 PM	If there is no deal in the works for a SS, and I'm not convinced of that right now, but if there is not a trade coming down the pike to solve the SS problem......this guy on a short-term deal wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. It's not ideal given his UZR number for last year, but there is absolutely no way the Astros offer arbitration given their budget situation, making him a better fit than Scutaro. In any case, good luck in Toronto, Sea Bass....... Madness is like gravity....all you need is a little push.
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FenwayTheHardWay		#28	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 1662 11/26/09 10:47 PM Veteran Member	buffs44444 wrote: If there is no deal in the works for a SS, and I'm not convinced of that right now, but if there is not a trade coming down the pike to solve the SS problem......this guy on a short-term deal wouldn't be the worst thing in the world. It's not ideal given his UZR number for last year, but there is absolutely no way the Astros offer arbitration given their budget situation, making him a better fit than Scutaro. In any case, good luck in Toronto, Sea Bass....... Maybe if Adrian Beltre is at third... but Tejada/Lowell on the left side? That's scary. "Jonathan Papelbon, not wasting any time, going to his bread and butter there, and that's the cheese."- Buck Martinez
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OCD SS		#29	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 671 11/26/09 11:15 PM Veteran Member	According to one source, the Red Sox were prepared to offer Gonzalez a 1-year contract in the vicinity of $3 million, but the club wanted to first explore other options on the trade and free-agent markets. Trade market? Escobar or bust? The idea of leaving Lowrie in Pawtucket looks more and more untenable. *"I'd like to fck Sandra Bullock"** - Pedro, explaining his secret ambition to Sports Illustrated for Kids.
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charliezink16		#30	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 248 11/27/09 12:58 AM	No way we give up a first rounder for a guy who can only go downhill. Especially with the way Sox first rounders develop into much better players than a Scutaro. I say trade for a Tejada and wait a year or two for Iglesias to come up Why give 100% when 35 can get you paid and laid. -Kenny Powers
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gator39		#31	[url]	[-]
Rookie Posts: 67 11/27/09 12:59 AM	I think this is a clear mistake to let Gonzalez go. All the alternatives on the free agent market are Type A free agents. About the best we can do for a non type a is Adam Everett.
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German RSN		#32	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 451 11/27/09 5:34 AM	charliezink16 wrote: No way we give up a first rounder for a guy who can only go downhill. Especially with the way Sox first rounders develop into much better players than a Scutaro. I say trade for a Tejada and wait a year or two for Iglesias to come up Tejada is a free agent so you can't trade for him. And on top of that he's a type A free agent. No way I want him on this team.
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Bury the Hammer		#33	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 596 11/27/09 10:17 AM Veteran Member	Arquimedez Bozo wrote: mredsox89 wrote: Definitely a mistake on the Sox's part to not pick up his $6M option. But one has to believe they have had another plan ready to set in motion. How do you figure? He got less than half of that. On no planet is Alex Gonzalez worth $6M, and apparently even he knows that. If you want to say it was a mistake not to just commit $3M to him now, then fine, we can agree to disagree there, but come on. Unless there's someone who they want more that they think they can get, how can you defend a team like the Red Sox for losing out on a player over a few million dollars? I'm not broken-hearted over it, but that's me, and it seems pretty clear that the Red Sox did want want him, "at a price". Kinda sounds laughable at these figures.
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Bury the Hammer		#34	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 596 11/27/09 10:17 AM Veteran Member	Arquimedez Bozo wrote: mredsox89 wrote: Definitely a mistake on the Sox's part to not pick up his $6M option. But one has to believe they have had another plan ready to set in motion. How do you figure? He got less than half of that. On no planet is Alex Gonzalez worth $6M, and apparently even he knows that. If you want to say it was a mistake not to just commit $3M to him now, then fine, we can agree to disagree there, but come on. Unless there's someone who they want more that they think they can get, how can you defend a team like the Red Sox for losing out on a player over a few million dollars? I'm not broken-hearted over it, but that's me, and it seems pretty clear that the Red Sox did want want him, "at a price". Kinda sounds laughable at these figures.
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soxprospects		#35	[url]	[-]
Posts: 7217 11/27/09 10:47 AM Mike Andrews Executive Editor SoxProspects, LLC	Uhh, they offered him more than the Blue Jays gave him, but they just weren't willing to commit to it until the Winter Meetings. AB's point is that it wasn't about the money at this point, it was that the Sox wanted to keep their options open for another week or so.
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Ephus		#36	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 1089 11/27/09 10:57 AM Veteran Member	The hand wringing over Alex Gonzalez is truly amusing to me, especially given this site. This is a prospect site, which means that most of us are wired to have a longer view of things than a SS who was acquired through waivers and just signed a deal for one million more than the 78-year-old shell named Omar Vizquel. For all of the mythology that Alex Gonzalez saved the Red Sox 2009 season, the team was swept in the ALDS. He had an OPB of .279 in 2009. For those of you who truly believe he will maintain a +.700 OPS over the enitire year in 2010, perhaps you would be interested in bringing back a certain outfielder who sported a .801 OPS for the Tribe in 2005, flashing real 20 HR potential. The idea that the Red Sox are now backed into a corner where it is Marco Scutaro or bust also reeks of panic that has no place when the calendar still reads "November." I, for one, am thrilled that the FO declined paying Sea Bass $6M. I am also thrilled that this move makes it entirely possible that Jose Iglesias gets the call when Jed Lowrie's wrist starts acting up in mid-May. "Things happen in Boston." -Joe Morgan
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adiospaydro2005		#37	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 1541 11/27/09 11:25 AM Veteran Member	Ephus wrote: The hand wringing over Alex Gonzalez is truly amusing to me, especially given this site. This is a prospect site, which means that most of us are wired to have a longer view of things than a SS who was acquired through waivers and just signed a deal for one million more than the 78-year-old shell named Omar Vizquel. For all of the mythology that Alex Gonzalez saved the Red Sox 2009 season, the team was swept in the ALDS. He had an OPB of .279 in 2009. For those of you who truly believe he will maintain a +.700 OPS over the enitire year in 2010, perhaps you would be interested in bringing back a certain outfielder who sported a .801 OPS for the Tribe in 2005, flashing real 20 HR potential. The idea that the Red Sox are now backed into a corner where it is Marco Scutaro or bust also reeks of panic that has no place when the calendar still reads "November." I, for one, am thrilled that the FO declined paying Sea Bass $6M. I am also thrilled that this move makes it entirely possible that Jose Iglesias gets the call when Jed Lowrie's wrist starts acting up in mid-May. Theo is already on record that the Red Sox aren't counting on Lowrie as a starter for the 2010 season given his injury history. Jose Iglesias is only 19 years old and he has played approximately 20 games in Arizona fall ball. Let's see how he handles AA pitching for at least half of the 2010 before annointing him as the starting shortstop for the Red Sox. Poorest spending of $3 million that I have ever seen.-fcastig 0220
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Yirmiyahu		#38	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 624 11/27/09 11:52 AM	If you're looking for a SS better than Gonzalez/Punto/Everett, I think the only alternatives to overpaying for Scutaro are... 1.) Trying to convince the Braves to let go of Yunel Escobar in a trade, by agreeing to take on Derek Lowe's $45 million contract. 2.) If the Angels sign a 3B, they're going to have to trade an infielder, considering that they have Kendrick at 2B, Aybar at SS, and that Brandon Wood (BA's #16 overall prospect in 2008) is overdue for a real shot on a MLB roster. If they therefore make Maicer Izturis available, I would love to have him as Boston's starting SS. He's got a career line of .278/.343/.393/.736, and a career UZR/150 of 4.7 at SS (1144.3 innings), and is in his last year of arbitration-eligibility... Of course, they may choose not to sign a third baseman, or if they do, may choose to trade Wood instead.
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SeaDog19		#39	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 259 11/27/09 11:52 AM Veteran Member	It's a long shot, considering Castro began the season in Class A last April and doesn't turn 20 until March 24. But the Cubs are so sold on his future that they already have told incumbent shortstop Ryan Theriot he might move to second base in the not-so-distant future. Chicago Tribune 11/27 If the Cubs are high enough on Castro to move Theriot to second base, I wonder if the Cubs would consider trading Theriot if the Sox were willing to take on a big contract like Fukudome or Bradley. Adding one of those two guys into the left field mix might be worth it to pick up one of the better shortstops in baseball.
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jdb		#40	[url]	[-]
Veteran Member Posts: 293 11/27/09 12:05 PM	I brought the same thing up earlier in this thread SeaDog. I would love Theriot at SS for a few years. I mentioned Bradley but their new hitting coach might could talk the front office in keeping him. Fukudome is a GG RF and might would let us move Drew to LF which would take some wear and tear off him playing 81 games at Fenway but he might leave our lineup with little pop and too left handed. Maybe they are sick of Zambranos antics. He has 3 more years left at basically 18 per. He does have a 2013 player vesting option for 19.25 that kicks in if he finishes in the top 2 for the 2011 Cy Young or top 4 in the 2012 voting and finishes the 2012 season healthy.
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Toronto Blue Jays sign Alex Gonzalez