TomRicardo wrote:
On the flip side, there is about zero chance the Yankees are trading Montero.
I'm not so sure that is an absolute certainty. 3B and 1B are locked up, he is not (according to talent evaluators) a ML catcher, DH is looking like Posada's future slot with maybe some Jeter (he had one of his best years at SS but time is not on his side) mixed in there when/if he is moved to the OF or simply needs a break from SS because of his age. RF??? Possibly but not the ideal situation. If you are ruling out catcher then the positions that make the most sense for this guy is 1B or DH and they seem to be accounted for. He is their best, most marketable trade chip and he could be used as the centerpiece or part of the meat of a big deal. The guy is (reportedly) a legit stud at the plate and then add in the traditional inflation of Yankee prospects worth and he is a prime candidate to be moved now before more evaluators discount his value based on where his bat plays.
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The Red Sox 2009-2010 Offseason Discussion Thread
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 bighead |
#1021 | |||
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Posts: 84 11/21/09 10:30 AM |
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TokenWilliams |
#1022 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 526 11/21/09 11:20 AM |
jspearlj1 wrote:Were you comparing this to the "lowrie/Bowden/Kelly/Reddick" scenario Buffs brought up or did I miss somethign else? I guess the reason I ask is because the only difference is Lin for Reddick and it brings me to my point about Reddick. Would anyone hesitate to trade Reddick for a player like Halladay? I understand there is more in the deal than him, but with Kalish right behind him and there no room for him on this team right now I really doubt he'd be a deal breaker. Plus, I think I'd rather Lin to Reddick if I were the Sox. Sure Reddick is closer to the majors but I like the Lin package a lot more than the Reddick package. Reddick is closer and doesn't appear to be anything special to me. Wouldn't surprise me to see a solid every day player, but we're not talking about a future star here where as with Kalish or Lin I think the possibility remains especially if they can stay in Center which Lin should have no problems with... I do agree if Billingsley is out there in a deal then that's goign to top anything the Sox can do for Halladay unless the Jays love Buchholz and Bard plus others, but I dont see the Sox doing something like that. Lackey may not like Fenway, but if the money is the highest coming out of Boston then he'll learn to like it pretty quickly... |
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TokenWilliams |
#1023 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 526 11/21/09 11:20 AM |
I'm very interested in bringing in either Sheets or Harden. I don't know who I'd prefer, but I think the Sox medical staff is better than any that
they have played for previously and it could do wonders for them. Beckett has been healthy since coming here and they did great thigns for both Smoltz and
Penny, both of whom spoke highly of the shoulder programs. i would think that this would give the Sox a leg up on players such as them. Especially Harden.
Take a short-term deal, being young, come here get healthy then leave or stay and make a lot more money. I cannot imagine the contracts being much different
around the league.
Edit: post duplicated so I added different thoughts so it wasn't redundant
Last Edited By: TokenWilliams 11/21/09 11:24 AM.
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buffs44444 |
#1024 | |||
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Moderator Veteran Member
Posts: 1353 11/21/09 11:43 AM |
jspearlj1 wrote: After two disappointing exits in the playoffs and the need for a legitimate ace to match with Kershaw and Kuroda (and potentially Wolf, who wants to return), I agree that the Dodgers are the best fit and have the biggest need. That, and the financial issues related to the McCourt's divorce, makes you wonder if the Dodgers will be trying to move some of their arbitration cases to facilitate the financial flexibility that they need. Cot's: Dodgers
Madness is like gravity....all you need is a little push.
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 Guidas |
#1025 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 85 11/21/09 12:48 PM |
TokenWilliams wrote:I think Sheets had the elbow tendon surgery, which is supposedly less "major" than TJ or rotator cuff repairs. He was also a 200+ inning horse before that with 1-2 stuff. I think he's a better gamble. Harden could blow something out signing the contract. |
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GreatByOhEight |
#1026 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 630 11/21/09 12:53 PM Veteran Member |
First post in over a year...
I was reading the "ideas" thread in the trade proposal, and saw that ASAL had mentioned the idea of absorbing Magglio Ordonez's massive contract in order to pickup Cabrera. I love it. I know, I know, it doesn't seem like an ideal situation, but think about it for a minute; Mags is still an effective run producer, and while he may not have the power he did in the past, he has always shown the kind of power to left field that plays well in Fenway. He might not be a superior defender, but he would likely be a tick above average. It's a ton of money, but on a one year deal and coupled with the ability to solidify the middle of the order with Miggy, I think it is an option well worth exploring. Also, I know that everyone is really into the idea of Harden, Lackey, or Sheets, but to me, it's Duchscherer or bust. He just seems like he would be the perfect pitcher at the perfect price.
"I want the Yankees to limp out of New York like they just did a guest spot on Oz" - Chach
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GreatByOhEight |
#1027 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 631 11/21/09 1:05 PM Veteran Member |
Guidas wrote:Ben Sheets IP by year: 2001- 151.1 2002- 216.2 2003- 220.2 2004- 237.0 2005- 156.2 2006- 106.0 2007- 141.1 2008- 198.1 For the sake of argument, you could say that 08 was 200 IP, but that was the first time since 04 when he was able to accomplish that, and it cost him his entire 09 season. I love Sheets' stuff, but he is just as much of a risk as Harden if not more (though likely cheaper IMO).
"I want the Yankees to limp out of New York like they just did a guest spot on Oz" - Chach
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DCRi |
#1028 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1180 11/21/09 1:51 PM Veteran Member |
This is the first time I have read that Kouzmanoff is a good defender. In the 2009 BP book they said he struggled to be average.
While I think the acquisition of a 3B would be better than moving Youk to third, (except in the unlikely event that AGon is acquired), the Sox need to do better than either Kouzmanoff or Beltre if they are going to do that. They would need to go after a premier 3B, like a Zimmerman. I think the Sox are inclined to go with Lowell if they don't get an elite 1B or 3B. He still is a very good hitter (I think still better than either Kouzmanoff or Beltre). He doesn't have the range he once had (although there seems to be some thought he will be better next year), but he is surehanded and a great team member. The Sox have made it quite clear they are going to have a SS other than Lowrie. Depending on who that is, Lowrie may or may not get a shot at SS. If he is OK he could be the supersub. With only 32 on the roster now, I wonder if the Sox are thinking of picking up one or more of the rumored soon to be large number of untendered players? |
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IBSmith85 |
#1029 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 77 11/21/09 4:15 PM |
DCRi wrote:I dont know what kind of defender Kouz was before this season, but there were some who thought he deserved the GG over Zimmerman. link.... http://espn.go.com/blog/sweetspot/post/_/id/1326/nl-gold-gloves-2-out-of-9-aint-bad And Ryan Zimmerman could be one of the most untouchable players in all of the league IMO. He is the Nationals entire organization aside from a flamethrowier with exactly 0 MLB IP's. "I will repeat as Rookie of the Year" - Dustin Pedroia
Last Edited By: IBSmith85 11/21/09 4:18 PM.
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DCRi |
#1030 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1181 11/21/09 4:35 PM Veteran Member |
Not making errors is not that significant a statistic. Some of the very best fielders make more errors than lesser ones because they get to more balls. I am
doubtful he went from just being adequate to GG level in one year.
Furthermore, he just is not that good overall. He is not a player for the Red Sox. I said "like Zimmerman." I know everybody says he is untouchable. I doubt any player on a team as bad as the Nationals is untouchable. I don't know why teams say such things. If they really means it then they are idiots.
Last Edited By: DCRi 11/21/09 4:44 PM.
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IBSmith85 |
#1031 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 78 11/21/09 5:02 PM |
The link for Kouz was just to show that there has been talk that he is a good defensive player, i know errors arent the best stat to look at. Like i said, i
dont know what kind of defensive player he was before this year.
And i do agree with you that "untouchable" is a word that gets throw around too much, but if there was a list of them, i think he would be near the top of it. For all i know Kouz could be a terrible defender and Zimm could be in a Sox uniform by the end of the week. "I will repeat as Rookie of the Year" - Dustin Pedroia |
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rangoon82 |
#1032 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 735 11/21/09 6:08 PM Veteran Member |
TokenWilliams wrote:Harden could be a great on a short term contract but is almost guaranteed to only pitch a fraction of the season. He literally hasn't had a full season in 5 years and 2004 was the only full season of his 7 year career. That said I'd take him on short money and I remember the Sox came close to trading for him in 2007 or so. |
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FenwayTheHardWay |
#1033 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 1642 11/21/09 6:15 PM Veteran Member |
rangoon82 wrote: He's also almost guaranteed to pitch well in that fraction of a season. Even with all his physical issues, he has never posted an ERA+ below 100. He and the Red Sox were made for each other.
"Jonathan Papelbon, not wasting any time, going to his bread and butter there, and that's the
cheese."- Buck Martinez
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buffs44444 |
#1034 | |||
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Moderator Veteran Member
Posts: 1354 11/21/09 6:32 PM |
I'd love to sign Harden merely for the chance to be the team where he realizes he could have a HOF career as a closer, and also most likely avoid the
injuries from the grind of pitching a 200+ workload.
Either way, he's great to watch pitch. He throws with the effort that looks like he's warming up in the bullpen and the gun shows high 90's. Amazing arm......
Madness is like gravity....all you need is a little push.
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jspearlj1 |
#1035 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 4953 11/21/09 6:36 PM |
FenwayTheHardWay wrote: While not an exact comparison, much the same was said about Smoltz last year. I agree that Harden is definitely a guy for the sox to go after since you know you'll need a pitcher to pair up with Timmy and whatever inevitable injuries befall the rotation throughout the year. |
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cemprae |
#1036 | |||
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Rookie
Posts: 5 11/22/09 1:15 AM |
Looking at his overall UZR numbers... (including his range and error ratings) Kouzmanoff looks almost exactly like Alex Gonzalez does at SS... and he's
maintained those numbers over two seasons (the year before that he was a rookie)... as far as Zimmerman is concerned... of course he is one of those guys you
put in the same category as Mauer... a great young player who fills a long time need at a position needed by the Sox... the point I was trying to make in the
Beltre/Kouzmanoff post was... you wouldn't have to drain the farm to do it...
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TokenWilliams |
#1037 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 531 11/22/09 1:32 AM |
Am I the only one not ready to annoint Zimmerman as a "great" player? If last year is the norm then I will be on board, but wasn't that a bit
of a surprise? His hitting was always the question with him. He had 3 great months and 3 not so good months. The year as a whole was very good, offensively
speaking. It certainly could be a break out; he's certainly young enough. I'll need to see another year before I'm ready to call him a middle of
the order bat, prime offensive weapon.
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TokenWilliams |
#1038 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 532 11/22/09 1:38 AM |
The Red Sox and their strengthening program are the perfect team for Harden. Elbow injuries are often a direct result of shoulder weakness. He's had issues in both areas and if the Sox signed him they would have the luxury of starting him off slowly by putting him on a strengthening program. With Wakefield, they could start Harden on the DL, get him back by mid/late May and hopefully have him strong for the rest of the season. He made 26 and 25 starts the last 2 years anyways and by the time he's ready Wake should be ready to go on a vacation. |
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ArodSucksAtLife |
#1039 | |||
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Veteran Member
Posts: 3801 11/22/09 3:35 AM Veteran Member |
TokenWilliams wrote:Yes, yes you are, and no it wasn't a suprise. Great player/middle of the order bat are completely different terms. Ryan Zimmerman is a great baseball player. Anyday that 25 year old wants to drop an .800+ OPS is gravy. Everything about Ryan Zimmerman is awesome. I am in love with Clayton Kershaw. I want him in me. - Curll84 |
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bighead |
#1040 | |||
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Rookie
Posts: 85 11/22/09 8:27 AM |
buffs44444 wrote: I've been wondering all offseason why no team has tried to move him to the pen. Is it that nobody has gotten to the point where they have given up on him finally staying healthy or is he resistant to the move? I am intrigued by his potential there. |
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