There's no way he could be gotten easily. My question is what you think it would take to trade for him and whether you think it would make sense for the Sox to do so.
Adrian Gonzalez
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becht |
Adrian Gonzalez |
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Gonzalez's average and production have dropped a bit recently after his hot start, but that's not terribly surprising given that he's literally the
only threat in San Diego's awful lineup and the ballpark he plays in. Batting at Fenway and in Boston's lineup, he could be sick. He's put up huge
numbers over the past few seasons despite the Padre's bad offense, he's just 27, and he's cheap through 2011.
There's no way he could be gotten easily. My question is what you think it would take to trade for him and whether you think it would make sense for the Sox to do so. |
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becht |
#1 | |||
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Oh, and he's that left handed bat that the sox so clearly need to boast a more well-rounded lineup.
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jsinger121 |
#2 | |||
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Welcome to the site becht. It would probably take Buchholz, Bard, and Anderson to start if I had to guess.
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becht |
#3 | |||
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Thanks for the welcome. It would be tough to give up Bard and Anderson, our potential closer and 1b of the future, respectively, but Lars at least makes sense
given that SD would be losing its current first baseman. I'd hate to lose Buchholz, though. Is there some other combination that could be equivalent to
trading him, like Bowden, another decent/good pitcher, and someone who could take over first base for them immediately (Bates, Kotsay, Bailey, etc)? And do you
think it would be worth trading so many good pieces for Gonzalez?
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jsinger121 |
#4 | |||
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Kevin Towers is not stupid. He isn't going to settle for mid tier prospects for Adrian Gonzalez. Michael Bowden is not going to be the center of the piece
of a trade either.
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soxfan79 |
#5 | |||
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kevin towers has already stated that he wants to keep both gonzalez and jake peavy. its next to impossible that the sox get him but if we were to make an
offer i would think it would be similar to:
buchholz anderson delcarmen and maybe one of our single a pitchers not named casey kelly |
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Papelbon58 |
#6 | |||
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How about:
Red Sox trade: Clay Buchholz, Michael Bowden (or a prospect received from a Penny trade in a 3 team deal), Lars Anderson, Mark Kotsay, and Felix Doubront Padres Trade: Adrian Gonzalez |
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Arquimedez Bozo |
#7 | |||
Papelbon58 wrote:Not sure the Sox would toss Buchholz in that one. The Padres would also not need a replacement 1B (I'm assuming that's why you tossed Kotsay in) as they have Kyle Blanks already. |
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Papelbon58 |
#8 | |||
Not sure the Sox would toss Buchholz in that one.Do you think that there is a way to get Gonzalez without giving up either Bard or Buchholz? While starters do have higher value, right now I am more inclined to keep Bard since Papelbon's future with the Red Sox is in question (I know I might be alone with my preference for Bard). If we could get Agon without giving up Bard or Buchholz I would do it in a heartbeat, as we need the presence of a strong young bat. Maybe something like this: Red Sox trade: Justin Masterson/Manny Delcarmen, Michael Bowden, Lars Anderson, Josh Reddick, and Felix Doubront Padres trade: Adrian Gonzalez P.S.- you were right, I only put Kotsay in there since I didn't know if they had a temperary replacement for Agon at 1B |
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soxfan 02 |
#9 | |||
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Blanks isn't a temporary replacement, he was there best prospect coming into the year. He has struggled since coming up because they have thrown him into
the spacious San Diego outfield were he will most likely be incapable of remaining since he is just south of 300 pounds, so Padres are probably not interested
in Anderson. I also believe that there is no way that the Sox can get Adrian without giving up Buchholz.
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Papelbon58 |
#10 | |||
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Do you think that the Padres would accept Clay Buchholz, Michael Bowden, and Stephen Fife for Gonzalez, and not have to give up Lars or Reddick when we would
already give up Clay and Bowden?
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jsinger121 |
#11 | |||
Papelbon58 wrote: That deal would get Kevin Towers fired in my opinion. Lars or Reddick would need to be in that deal. |
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becht |
#12 | |||
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Tough call. Gonzalez could easily be the difference maker in our lineup, but you hate to give up a potential ace in Buchholz. Besides, I could be wrong, but I
think that other than Clay, we really don't have any front-of-the-rotation caliber prospects. Bowden, Tazawa, Kelly, etc could end up being good, but there
isn't really a Josh Beckett or a Jon Lester among them. We'll see. Maybe in a few years I'll be eating those words. (I hope I am.)
On the other hand, it's hard to see SD doing any trade without Clay, even if we offer some other good players. Trades are never about exchanging equal value; they're about how much the needier team is willing to sacrifice to get what it wants. San Diego is in the position of power here, and they're going to use all the leverage they can. |
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soxcentral |
#13 | |||
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MVPedroia15 posted this
link in the Off-season thread, and it had an interesting proposal.
Their version: We get: Adrian Gonzalez SD gets: Reddick and/or Kalish, Lars, Bowden, Stolmy/Doubront, Navarro I would tweak this slightly, but like the general parameters and feel it is a sellable package for Hoyer. Trading a franchise guy is not going to be popular, but if he can market it as a way to get a real foundation for the future I think he'd be able to pull it off. My version: We get: Gonzalez SD gets: Lars - the heir to the 1B position and an obvious inclusion. Bowden - Immediate rotation help and a solid, inexpensive #4 starter that will still be around to help them as the build for 2011-12. Reddick OR Kalish - Not both. As the previous article said, the Padres must have OF's with defensive skills. Add their offensive upside and either can be a real nice fit for them. I say not both because our OF situation looks like it will be fluid over the next couple years, and we may really need a solid two-way player out there. Adam Mills, Caleb Clay, or another lower level prospect - Considering some of the other parts the Padres get here, I think another top prospect is too much to give up. Giving them a 5th part that can add depth to their system and potentially fill a long to middle reliever spot down the road would be fair, not Stolmy or Doubront. Although if this were the hold up in getting a deal done, I'd probably cave and give them a slightly better arm. Certainly not Bard or Kelly. Lowrie - I think Iglesias will be the SS in the not too distant future anyways, and Lowrie doesn't sound well-suited to move over to 3B. This is a replacement to the inclusion of Navarro above, simply because I think Navarro will have a better shot at filling the 3B hole than Lowrie does. For SD, adding Lowrie to their middle infield mix with Eckstein returning, plus Cabrera, they give themselves a nice trio moving forward at a very reasonable cost. |
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jdb |
#14 | |||
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I dont think they would want Lars. They have Blanks in LF right now put he is out of position and plays 1B. I also think we would have to give up at least a
Bard in a package.
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SoxSail |
#15 | |||
soxcentral wrote:Would you give up Youkilis at the end of last year (closest thing we have to Gonzalez in terms of being a franchise player) for a (possibly) washed up 1B prospect, a 4th starter a potential starting outfielder (if things go right) a low level prospect, and a short stop that is often injured and doesn't field the position exceptionally well? You're going to need to include a lot more than that to pry Gonzalez from them. I agree that Bard is part of the deal, as is Kelly. These are two true major league talents. You still have to add Kalish/Reddick, Bowden, Navarro and possibly some lower level minor leaguers to avoid giving up more MLB ready talent (read, Buchholz). And even then, I'm not at all sure this is a deal that Hoyer would even consider... but he might at least return your phone call. |
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soxcentral |
#16 | |||
SoxSail wrote:If we were a non-contender building for 2-3 years out I would strongly consider any deal that could fill multiple positions well, including trading Youk. Factor in the need for a small market team to have numerous cost-controlled players contributing, and I would consider it even more. In retrospect, maybe you move a major-league bullpen piece like Delcarmen instead of a lower level arm like Mills/Clay. However, I personally do not make any deal for Gonzalez that includes a key arm like Bard. This is not an overwhelming haul, but it has enough useful pieces to make it work, in my opinion. Lars - Top 50 prospect as recently as last year who is still very young and potentially very good. Bowden - Likely a #4, but could even play up in the NL West. Either way, he's cheap and fills a rotation spot. Delcarmen - Despite his rough finish he has overall shown to be unhittable in stretches, making him a valuable setup guy for the Padres. Lowrie - Injury-riddled lately, but a potentially solid two-way contributor. Reddick/Kalish - Another potentially valuable two-way talent going their way. All 5 are likely to contribute by 2011 to varying degrees. They all fit nicely from a financial perspective, critical for a franchise like this. In my opinion the key is how much of a believer Hoyer is with guys like Lars, Lowrie, Bowden and MDC. If he believes he is getting all 4 from a buy-low perspective, this can be exactly the type of franchising-changing trade that sets them up for a good 2-4 year run. If he doesn't, well, obviously this proposal has no shot. |
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rangoon82 |
#17 | |||
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Using this framework from Amfox
Red Sox trade chips (in no particular order):Trade Proposal: Ellsbury, Bard, Bowden, Exposito for AGon. I think that trade def. gets it done, may even be an overpay. Part of me would rather keep Buchholz over Ellsbury b/c pitching is just too valuable. Pedroia R 2B Drew L RF VMart S C AGon L 1B Youk R 3B Ortiz L DH Cameron R CF Defense-first FA? Prospect? LF Scutaro R SS Lester LHP Beckett RHP Lackey RHP Daisuke RHP Buchholz RHP Wake RHP (6th man) |
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dadesfan |
trade | #18 | ||
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Sheehan at Baseball Prospectus proposed giving them Beckett, not Bucholz., or Kelly. Beckett has only one year left on his contract before he becomes a free
agent.Anyone have any ideas.? dadrsfan
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soxprospects |
#19 | |||
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Buchholz-Reddick-Ramirez-Lars-Bowden. That's a potential haul for SD with a decent chance of resulting in five inexpensive starters, each of which have
varying potentials to be major impact players. I think if a trade ever goes down, it will look something like this. If it goes down during the season, Lowrie
could also be bait if he can show some semblance of being able to stay reasonably healthy.
I think this is my first time stepping foot in this sub-forum. |
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chavopepe2 |
#20 | |||
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Ellsbury, Kelly, and Bowden.
I have a hard time believing Hoyer would consider a deal that didn't have two of amfox1's top tier. |
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